Embodiment Part 2: Embracing Your Childless Self: Embodiment Practices with Sarah Jane

My amazing guest, Sarah Jane Smith takes us into an aspect of embodiment that creates healing of the heart through the cultivation of trust towards the body. 

Our relationship with our bodies can be complex and nuanced as our minds create disconnect through traumas big and small. For many childless not by choice women, the relationship with the body suffers, especially when it seems to fails at creating  deeply desired motherhood. 

Listen as we discuss: 

• Our mutual mission of cultivating and uncovering joy in the childless life.
• Consciously and compassionately giving healing to the parts that suffered on this journey
• How the body can feel like the problem but is actually the way back to joy and confidence if we allow it 
• Recalibrating your senses through self- awareness and empowering your decision making process

In Sarah's words:

WHY I TEACH EMBODIMENT 

I teach to support other childless, not by choice, women on their path to recovery from the struggles of their infertility journey. These are potent practices of self-awareness that can increase confidence, ease anxiety, nurture self-compassion and uncover joy.

GET SARAH'S FREE GUIDE HERE:
https://thenestyogastudio.ck.page/8530ddd025

"I hear you, the holidays are hard for childless women. The feelings of loss loom large, part of you wants to skip the whole thing, and another part wants to celebrate. I get the paradox."

INTRODUCING ... RECLAIM THE HOLIDAYS:

A guide with 13 suggestions on how childless women can take care of themselves and create meaning during the holidays. Plus journaling prompts to help you create realistic goals and take manageable action steps towards reclaiming the holidays this year.

Transcript

Sarah Jane Smith of Embodied Possibility

Linda00:00

So today I'd like to welcome Sarah Jane  to ladies like us. She's the creator of embodied possibility. A platform filled with multiple pathways of healing for people who are childless, not by choice. I was struck by Sarah Jane's, compassion, generosity, kindness, groundedness, and really just joy.

These were the words that came to mind when I saw what she was creating in the world of child was not by choice healing. Um, I feel very aligned with her mission and her vision, and I'd love forher to just share with us,

Sarah Jane00:40

um, really

Linda00:41

what she's created. So welcome Sarah Jane.

Sarah Jane00:45

Wow. Thank you. So such a lovely introduction.

I feel very honored to be here and, uh, yeah, it's such a lovely way to introduce me and I feel really like you have seen what I offer because that's the intention behind it. Um, compassion is a huge driver of, uh, my own personal healing journey, but also the foundation of what I share with others, I'd say that was sort of like the main pillar and that comes in a few ways.

That can be, um, straight through self-compassion meditation practice or exercises can be an approach of curiosity, kindness, and compassion to mindful movement. I'm a Vinyasa teacher for,I guess, maybe 12 years now and yoga student students for quite a bit longer. Uh, so that comes into my work. That's sort of also another foundation of the work is mindful movement and using, um, Sort of yoga based movement to reestablish a trust and connection with your body.

And that for yourself, I found in my own journey to childlessness that that had been. Set hurt. And I felt like that was a really accessible entry point to build myself back up and to an open to possibility about what my, what my life might look like. Even though it doesn't look like I thought it was going to be, but that.

That there's possibility

Linda02:36

of corners. Of course. And I love the, um, the intentionality.  I really do see you as an innovator in this arena where you are taking kind of some traditional modes and then some slightly less traditional loans.

And,  you're creating a kind of  methodology, um,  in an arena that really like was not spoken about for so long. And so I love what you've created and, um, I think I, our audience would love to hear your motherhood journey as much as you'd like to share that.

Sarah Jane03:10

Yeah, it's funny. It is. Isn't, isn't a motherhood journey. Is it an other hood journey? Motherhood? It's, it's interesting to, to yeah. To label it. And these are all definitely words that, um, that we can use, but yeah. I don't know whether it would be motherhood, but let's say to where I am now. So.My husband and I, um, we tried to conceive a word, uh, successful a couple of times, but it ended in, uh, miscarriages.

And then there were sort of, this is like, it was spread out over a long time. It wasn't a very concentrated, um, effort. It's a sort of like, Getting pregnant, having Ms. Parrish, not trying for a while because of the grief and the sort of feeling of, uh, like having the rug pulled out from underme and that kind of thing.

And then trying again and, and long spans of, of nothing. And that came with lots of tests. No, allof the things too, they try to do to explain why that my conception wasn't happening. And then when I did get pregnant, I wasn't able to carry the baby to term and, uh, So there was what they call unexplained infertility, which I actually kind of think isn't as a bit of a myth, if they put a bit more,  effort and funding into,  finding out and, uh, a bit more in-depth research, they'd be able to find out what, what was, what causes a lot of infertility.

that's an aside opinion. Um, and then. I have a, I have a history of fibroids. And so I had an, a quite a number of years ago, I had what they call a myomectomy. And so that's where they removed the. growths that, um, can be in a number of places in your reproductive system.

And in mind they were inside the uterus. Sometimes they're in the wall like half in, half out. Um, but they can. Remove them, but at least scar tissue. And, uh, it creates what the, I was lovingly told as, uh, an inhospitable uterus because of the scar tissue and then, because their fibroids kind of grow back, you don't have them removed and then they're gone and just kind of keep going.

And they they're like one cell that doesn't have an off switch. So it just keeps going bigger and bigger and bigger and bigger. So, um, I had a fibroid that was like seven or eight pounds, so it was very large and. It filled up my lower belly. So it looked like I was pregnant. So through, um, not being able to get pregnant multiple miscarriages and not being able to conceive and having all this unexplained, infertility around and looking like I was pregnant.

Oh God, a lot of like, like, oh, I didn't know you were pregnant or, oh, when do you do you are like, you know, oh, you're going to make such a great mom, like all of those kinds of freedom out of your knee. Yeah. I'm kind of like solicit. Tom ants and I live in a small town, so it was just sort of amplified, you know, go out into the grocery store and to see loads of people that I know.

But, um, so the, the fibroids and the growth of them, um, led me to have a hysterectomy. 'cause they at my age and with the, um, the history of not being able to carry a pregnancy, it was sort oflike, yes, we can remove the fibroids. Um, but we don't know if, it's going to going that you're going to be able to have a baby.

And it had been about eight years of trying and losses and not trying and all that.  And honestly, I was really just ready for it to be over. You know, it was kind of clear that it was this wasn't going to happen. And, um, it turned out anyway, when I had the surgery, they couldn't have taken the fibroid without taking the whole uterus, just because of where it was placed.

Um, So one bonus of that is that I knew going in that I was having a hysterectomy, had I chosen the other way. I would've come out of the surgery thinking that I would have had a uterus, but then not. So that's one saving grace is that I got to choose it so that, uh, while it wasn't any choice that I really wanted to make, uh, it didn't feel quite like I had no choice.

Linda08:02

that's an important

Sarah Jane08:02

distinction to make. And I really felt that it was. Like a closing of a chapter. And I had that like linein the sand that like definite date, like, okay, this, this trying to conceive is over. Um, which I felt like was a blessing. Because for so many years, we'd played with that question of like, oh, well, should we just stop trying?

Or, you know, but what if, and this whole like messaging from the infertility community to like never give up and like, you know, your thoughts create your reality. And if you're thinking about. Um, stopping trying, then that's the reason you can't get pregnant. Like all of that, which I will say is complete mess of messaging, which I do not agree with whatsoever.

It's very, it's highly problematic. And I think it kept me in a space of not making a decision for so long, you know, you know, so, I feel well, I'm, don't want to say lucky. Is that a word that I want to use? I'm not sure, but, uh, there was that a definite ending, you know, that I could be like, okay, this is a chapter now in my life that is closed.

And, um, it brought about its own. New levels of grief, for sure. Uh, but it also was kind of like a big sigh of relief. Like all of that energy, all of that attention, not focus concentration, uh, that I put into, trying to conceive and trying to, to have a baby it's like, well now where is all that energynow going to go?

Which was overwhelming at first, because I didn't actually realize. How much energy that was, and it also didn't realize that I had had this sort of, was it really making long-term plans? BecauseI was like, oh, well, what if we have a baby? Like, we can't book a hiking holiday and wherever, and from two in two years from now.

Cause like, what if we have a baby, you know, so. it really shortened my scope of plans for, my life. And so having this line in the sand allowed, uh, allowed me to step over the threshold and to like, okay, well now what?

Linda10:25

Yeah, I really resonate with that, um, piece of, you know, Staving off any long-term planning because it's like, your life could just be so different in an instant and you just keep waiting for that news, but you're in suspension or you're at that fork in the road for so long  And I like what you said about being a choice. I think for me, it was not as, from a line in the sand, but it was like,in my mind, I was like, okay, we're not trying anymore. And there's no, um, you know, doctors andmedicine and, and all this stuff. It's like, Nope, it's just, I kind of internally knew this was the time to stop.

And then it was like, oh wow, I have all this energy. And here's a, now, now I have a road ahead ofme. And it's, it's an open road. Wow. So it's pretty, like, it's not what we want, but there's an element of joy to coming back into oneself and allowing that there is a real. Right and not being color.

Sarah Jane11:27

yeah, not being stuck at the four, you know, and realizing that it is actually a fork because often I think w why would have such tunnel vision with, , having a baby?

I didn't realize that there were other people. To take, you know, I haven't put any energy into exploring what that might be for me and what that might look like. And also because of really having that reflected back to me from sort of other people in my life who were had experienced,like similar but unique, uh, paths that, Came to childlessness.

I didn't, even though now it's funny through doing this work. I realize that there's quite a few people in my life. Other women who are child does not by choice, but because it's not somethingthat I ever really spoke about, um, to sort of like a wider circle or a wider group of people, I didn'tsee that reflected back to me, like people who were like a few steps ahead of me, you know, or like had, had, had that line in the sand or made that decision like one or two years ago.

I didn't see what their life might look like. So it wasn't really hard to imagine, you know, they're surrounded by people who have have families and families in the traditional sense of the word, meaning having children.

Linda12:49

Yeah. Yeah, that's so that's so interesting, but you're right. And I think that, um, previously, uh, people were reluctant to.

Kind of proclaim it just like let anyone else know that. And nobody wants to admit that they tried for a thing and then they didn't get it. Right. And it feels like failure. And yet, you know, the, how common, how much more common it is than we realize. And when we finally see a success storysure.

You know, there are a lot of them, but again, nobody's announcing like, okay, I'm not trying anymore.  Right and therefore, I think groups like that we are involved in and highlighting. Um, the,what, what life looks like when we don't have this and what the possibilities ours is so important.

Um, and there's different stages of it. And, and, and so, us having met in that group, the child was not by choice and we can see like what a spectrum. It is like, you know, what degree of acceptance, what degree of, um, Taking ownership for your life and your joy versus feeling, uh, continuously victimized or at,  war really with yourself on some level, more like failure or, you know, being upset with your body.

And that's what I'd love for you to start talking about is a little bit like how you. How you came to connect those dots. I mean, it's a very obvious thing. Like on one level you feel like your body failed you, but I think that people move past that part to just feeling like, oh, their life is less than,and they never  come back into that relationship with their body.

It's like fractured and then they just, you know, move past, but not happily. And so tell us a little bit about how you connected those dots.

Sarah Jane14:47

I think it was through my own personal practice. So not, I'm not only a teacher of yoga and I practice it myself, you know, not with other, without other people around and just for me. And,

I realized so much of my practice was just kind of going through the motions, like going through these different, um, poses.

And I didn't really feel very much, you know, it's just sort of like, huh, like that's kind of interesting. Yeah. I can do all these shapes with my body and it feels okay to gain strength and a little bit of flexibility, but. I'm in the past, I'd had this sort of deeper access to sort of like what was going on inside, and sort of recognizing just what different things felt like.

So, and so I'd had that realization on the mat and then I sort of like started to be aware of it in myday-to-day life. And I realized. Huh, I'm not even really sure. Like what does it feel like to be hungry? Like I just was, was eating lots of food, but at mealtimes, you know, like a breakfast is at eight 30 and lunches at noon and dinner is at six 30  and I'm not even really considering it, you know, and the same thing with being thirsty, not registering the physical sensations of thirst.

So that's also kind of where I started it as well with those really sort of, um, Mike base human needs, you know, what does it feel like in my body to be hungry? What does it feel like to eat good food and then feel energized from it? What does it feel like to be hydrated versus dehydrated? You know, so these very sort of basic things that are available to all of us, that all the time, and it costs anything, you know, to be able to start to reestablish that.

But also the trust of like, okay, I'm hungry. So therefore I'm going to eat. And it does sound simple. Oh, but, that's not always the case. It could be like, well, I'm hungry, but I've got this huge to-do list. So I've got to go do this, or like, I'm hungry, but it's not actually dinner time, so I'm not going to eat.

So this way it's so many of us do that, where we sort of shut down the very clear signals that ourbody is sending us, you know, for these things like food and water, um, And we get into that habit. So if we're doing that for a basic needs, we're also doing that in so many other areas of ourlife too. Like where am I not I'm opening myself up and following a path that I feel like excited or, or joyful about, or how would I even recognize what joy feels like I've been down in the depths of.

Grief and loss and nothing working out and just feeling like hamster wheeling and this, this like spiral of loss, you know, how would I even know what joy feels like? So starting at the very basic level, uh, and I don't mean basic as in like, It's easy. I just mean basic as in like foundational, you know, like hunger and thirst, I'm starting to reconnect just what those, what that felt like.

And in a moment that I caught myself, um, like laughing or joking and being like, oh, this is what, like, when I smile, like I feel it in my face. Right. But where else do I feel it in my body? Like, I feel it here in my chest. I feel a little lift in my valley. And so taking those, uh, things that I've experimented with myself and bringing them in onto the mat and move on practice and start to get to know.

What that feels like. And especially, you know, with trust, like, can I trust myself to stand on one leg, you know, say in tree pose, yoga based movement. And while it might seem like, oh, well, I mean, just cause you can trust yourself to stand on one leg doesn't mean that that's going to likeaffect how you trust yourself in other areas of your life.

But it actually does. If you practice it with consistency and with the intention that that's what you're doing. Like when I practice Tripos, um, practicing, trusting myself and practice. If I need toput my foot down to create stability, then I'm practicing, creating stability for myself and not staying in a shape where I feel unstable.

Because of some other reason. I'm taking care of myself, I'm doing what I need. I mean, I

Linda19:37

love that. I love the fact that, um, you know, because we, we do stay in our head too much. And then as you said earlier, you were just going through the poses so we can kind of just not think and just let our body do the thing.

Really solidify the pathway from our mind to our body. And this is one way to do it, is that intentionality of it. And so like, as you're doing posts, like really strengthening those, those good thoughts, those empowering thoughts so that the body learns the lesson as well as the mind.And really, I think you, you kind of tap into the intuition, the intuitive part, um, Like you said, how do we even know, like, what does joy feel like?

What does this feel like? And it's strange that we could lose that connection. But I think that there's something just in, in, in modern times where everything is so externalized that we forget to tap right back in and to know what it is for ourselves. We, that looks like joy on the TV, but like,what is joy inside?

Right. So, yeah.

Sarah Jane20:47

Yeah. And you couldn't try and emulate what you see or think of as joy on the TV and it may or may not work and that's okay. You know, um, a big part of it for me and in my, teaching is that it's, it's all an experiment, you know, we're approaching. With curiosity and kindness. And we're seeing like what works for you and that all,  has an, a foundation of empowerment, you know, rightfrom the beginning.

Um, when we're. Prescribed like do this and you'll get to, you know, a or B it's like, here's a wholebunch of different things. Um, you know, it could be the mindful movement, maybe that's the, the self-compassion meditation or the exercises and something else to do. And lead is writing with prompts and then there's opportunities to share what you've written.

So that might, that might be the thing that really does it for you. You know? So it's this, not this sort of. One size fits all. It's a really like, let's figure it out.

Linda21:59

Kindness and curiosity. That's uh, I love that. I feel like that is so,  confidence building too, just totake ownership like, oh, this is what works for me.

And like you said, for some of might just be. Practicing over and over for others. Like journaling might be the thing that really integrates the lesson. And so,  you're presenting like this beautiful cornucopia of options as to like how this work can resonate. And I love that.

Sarah Jane22:29

Yeah. I feel it's really important. especially coming from a yoga background where it's like, this is the pose, like this is proper alignment, you know, like one specific thing. And we have like a vision in our mind of like, you know, what somebody would look like in that shape. And we're trying to like force herself.

Into that sheep, you know, and that's not necessarily going to work and that's not the point of it, you know, sort of the, the shapes are an opportunity to explore and to tap into sensation and, or even, realize I heard you say earlier about, um, something like amplifying or foregrounding that the good thoughts or the positive thoughts.

It's, um, it's really more about making space for all of the thoughts and the feelings. So this is the, um, the work of self-compassion. It's not that where, um, you know, we might have a thought or a feeling that is a bit confronting or let's say it's sad. We're not covering up sadness with kindness where making space to feel what we feel within a container.

And that's the important part that it's not going to be. I'd fully, let myself like go into this deep dark sadness with no support for, you know, days, weeks, months. It's okay. I have this 15 minutes and I'm going to make myself really comfortable in whatever position that is going to seta timer. And I'm going to let myself feel really sad and it makes space for that.

And that in and of itself is self-compassion you're making space for whatever it is that you meet within yourself.

Linda24:15

Love that distinction. Yeah. Creating like a more robust way of,  accepting our own feelings. Um, that makes so much sense. Given the sort of trajectory that one. Um, be experiencing from like say finding you and wanting to start this work, um, overcoming,  the grief depending on where they are in their journey, whether it's an old degree for a newer, grief or trauma, but, um, yeah, no, that makes so much sense.

Um, especially in light of what we were talking about. Not simply just having this toxic positivity, but really  there's a way to kind of hold. Like, I don't love that this happened and you know, I get todo this. And so integrating those pieces I think is, is super, super powerful.

Sarah Jane25:06

Yeah, it's definitely a both and situation, not an either or which in and of itself.

It's like when you're not trying to cover one thing up with another, that it just, when you're focused more on creating the space for, for your whole self, we're not going to come to a place where we only ever have positive. Missions. Right. But if we we're constantly orientating ourselves there and not really looking back here, this pile behind us, this sort of like stack of unresolved, not so great emotions is just going to be right there, you know?

So if you can start to, in a way that feels safe and manageable, Uh, supportive for you, you know,and that might mean, uh, if you have a more acute, uh, grief or trauma working with a psychotherapist or a, or a counselor, and if  that's not so, uh, super present. So you know where it's, uh, it's causing everything else then.

Yeah. Working with. Uh, coach or joining a group class where you just get to experiment with these different ways of interacting with yourself it CA it can be really profound for some people. Yeah.

Linda26:25

Yeah. I really do love the way you use the word experiment. Um, I think it's, um, really valuable for women in the other hood it's, it's like, depending on, you know, where you're at either way, you are creating a life that you want to enjoy,  be proud of. And  you think about how we have the pathway of like what the traditional life is supposed to look like. And we don't have that.

I love engaging in curiosity Like we, we have this time and energy to explore other ways of being.And so for myself and, , the people that I coach as well as the people I love spending time with, I find that. Um, most people are  somewhat creative in their life that  at discovering like what they're passionate about and how they connect and how they create communities.

So, um, yeah. Just love your use of that word.

Sarah Jane27:22

Yeah. I, I mean, when you. I think about and you break down the, the ideas that we have, like the, the road, the pathway that we're all supposed to be on or want to be on. Um, that's all just made up. Right.  And so, so many things, so many things in my life that I've tried, haven't worked out how I necessarily wanted them, them to be, um, So adopting the, this, uh, this, it's almost like a foundation of like, okay, I'm gonna, I'm going to approach this and just like, see what happens.

It's exciting for one thing, but it also takes like the. The feeling of a bit, if it doesn't really work outor you discover that's not actually from me, there's no sort of element of like, oh, I failed at that because we haven't already like thought or pictured ourselves in this place, um, that we think we should be.

And we haven't managed to get there, you know?

Linda28:24

Yeah. Yeah. That's, uh, that's, that's really a, I like that. Yeah. We can't fail at it because nobody even thinks like we're supposed to have to do that in the first place. So, um, yeah. Yeah. I think you're creating your own road and like, nobody knows like, oh, okay.

I don't really want that road after all. That's really good. Yeah,

Sarah Jane28:42

Friday, but not, but not really what I expected. It's not what I thought it didn't feel that. Great. So I'm going to maybe just go away a little bit. Which I mean, it's, It's a difficult approach to adopt after being on, um, such a focused path, of you know, trying to have a child to then not have thatand be like, whoa, well there's this whole other world like, can be super overwhelming and. Probably already feeling vulnerable and a bit like tossed around by the world.

So it's not like all of a sudden you're going to jump into this experimental way of, of being in life. Like it's just like everything. It's a slow process to like, figure out. What does that even look like for me? And what does that feel like? And so bringing it back to the mat and sort of like the container of the mindful movement practice, it's like, well, we can practice experimenting with different shapes.

So again, using the, um, example of tree pose, there's so many different shapes you can make with your arms when you're in tree pose. You know, the quote unquote traditional is like hands to get in front of your heart, but you could have your arms like straight out to the side with your palms down on your arm, straight out to the side with your palms up, you could have a more of a V-shape.

You could wiggle your thing. You could interlace your fingers. You can release your index. Thingslike these are all options. And so within the practice, it's sort of, it's a place to experiment and see what if. But like to experiment and for some people it can be quite confronting. It's like, no, I want to come to this cough.

And I want you to tell me what to do. I'm going to put my foot here. I wanna put my other foot here. I want to put my hands together. And that's great. So that person needs, um, I smaller amount of experimentation and more, uh, specific instructions, you know, whereas somebody who's just ready to like, you know, whatever they're doing, like seaweed, floaty, arms, and you haven't even suggested it, that that's someone who's at a different relationship with experimentation, you know?

And so in, um, in my group classes, There's a wide range of what people are doing. You know, it's not the idea isn't to, for everybody do the same thing. We have a framework. Of course, otherwise we'd be doing nothing because, but it's sort of like within the framework here are all the options. So it's really interesting to see how different people interact with, with the choice.

Cause even the way that you sort of describe myself as childless, not by choice. And I didn't have a choice and so many stages along the way. Like I didn't choose to have two miscarriages. Idon't necessarily choose to have a hysterectomy. I was given an option, but,  like not very great outcomes with either option.

And so. I found myself, I got to a place where I didn't wasn't really comfortable making choices. So many of these things have been big. Things have been decided for me. So it's like my choice as well. It's like the choice that I make never worked out. It never came to fruition. So am I like, am I not good at making choices?

I don't. I'm not really having any practice at it becoming, uh, going somewhere that I thought it might go. Um, So a big part of the mindful movement practice as well is, um, is practicing making choices. And that can include just like, no, I'm not actually don't, I don't want to do this shape. I want to feel like I want to lie down right now and I'm going to turn the camera off.

I might even leave the class. I actually need a cup of tea and that's my choice at the moment, you know? Um, and that there's not a lot of spaces. But you can really be free to practice choice in the moment. You know, there's so many constraints and it's like, well, this is how you're supposed to act, and this is what you're supposed to be doing.

And this is rude or this is acceptable. And, and, uh, it just says another layer of creating a sense of agency, to be able to practice making choices and anything you decide is okay. Wow. That is

Linda33:30

really a powerful thing that you are creating a space for, to, to learn to master, to explore what have you. Um, yeah, I was enthralled just now really thinking about.

The enormity of that, like it's so gentle and micro in the sense that you're incremental, right? Likejust these little degrees. And yet it's like that small degree that can change everything when it goes on that trajectory. So, um, wow. I just got chills thinking about it. So, um, again, thank you for just showing up.

So, so powerfully in this arena that I know not everyone knows exists. But, um, what you're creating is, is, is truly powerful. And the fact that you have the eyes to see the need for this is just, yeah, I'm lucky to have you.

Sarah Jane34:27

Thank

Linda34:27

you. So tell us how, how can we find you and your work? What's the best way?

Sarah Jane34:35

The best way is on Instagram  Which is embodied possibility. So it's at embodied possibility and that's actually how to find your old platforms. But, um, , my bio in Instagram has a, has a link and it has tons of different ways to access. We have a ton of free practices as links to my website, links to blog posts, um, right now where I don't know when this is going to air, but we're in the holiday season.

Okay. And so I have a free, uh, guide to what I'm calling, reclaiming the holidays traditionally, traditionally, no, not traditionally in the past. Know a word that, yeah, whatever in the past this time. Um, has been really hard for me. And I've also heard this, spoken about by many other childless women, is that it, you know, sort of Christmas holiday celebrations are really focused on children in agriculture, and that if you don't have that, then sort of like, what do you do?

Like, what are you allowed to do? And, you know, Do you want, you want to put up a Christmas tree, but you feel like, oh, well it's just for me then it was not like let's not even bother kind of thing. so I have this free guide to what I'm calling, reclaiming the holidays. And so it's a, um, I was 13 suggestions on different.

This is a brainstorm that I had on ways that you could reclaim the holidays. And then a few sheets of journaling questions to sort of like, Make a goal, or brainstorm your own and plan and how you're actually going to like, make it happen. So that's available through my, um, the link in my bio on Instagram as well.

Linda36:21

Amazing. I love that ladies like us. Um, yeah, grab that free gifts, um, because. The holidays can be a rough time, depending on how surrounded by family or not you are. And, um, you know, to what degree you have access to, to children, um, or other sort of traditional aspects of holidays. And so I think it's really important.

We talked to. Um, being creative and finding ways to really decide what the holidays can mean for you and how you wish to, to live them out and enjoy them. So I love that. So find her at embodied possibility on Instagram. I'm Sarah Jane. Thank you so much. This has been. Just to delight and, um, your work, like I said, is really powerful and I want to support you in any way I can, so I will be plugging your services.

Um, do you have any final message for our audience?

Sarah Jane37:24

They're big. Thank you to you for creating this podcast and making a space for women like us to come together and share what the possibilities are. So thank you for that final words. I don't know. It's such a big question, you know.  Maybe start to, if you're not already look around for places where you, where other women like us hang out. And there are many of them. Um, so for you type in child was not by choice and to Facebook search bar, you'll find all of them. They're allfree to join. Um, there's also a paid community through gateway women, um, and the sort of giveaccess and, um, sort of place our experience in context.

And a lot of the struggles and the grief and the loss, it feels like we're isolated, you know, we're, we're going through it alone. and I have just found it really helpful to, to know that. That's not necessarily true. It doesn't alleviate all of, um, of the work and the time that we put into, um, integrating our experience in whatever way, where we're doing that.

But knowing that there's a large population of women who are, are childless, um, and seeing myself reflected in those, those women as. As has changed things a lot from me, it's been a big source of finding the sense of freedom and making these connections with other women. So even though, you know, there's loads of folks online that I've had lots of zoom calls with and never met, but I feel.

These were men get me on a level that even some of my closest friends don't because they haven't experienced what I've experienced. And I find it's really valuable to that. People get you on that level.

Linda39:43

Absolutely. I know. I see us as little sparks of light forming a constellation, and if you train your eye to see, it's actually a pretty starry sky,  of us. So I definitely, um, encourage you to, to reach out and,  you know, find your sisterhood here. Different degrees of,  where we are in the journey, but to be sort of pre understood in this way is definitely invaluable. So thank you for that.

We hope to talk to you sometime soon, have an amazing holiday and we will look for that guide